vvk
- Mar 13, 2007 8:03 am
(#1 Total: 17)
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Run-flats is one of the reasons I decided to go with a used BMW instead of a new one. I despise the idea of not having a spare tire.
The other major reason is those unfathomable red rear turn signals. In the most unbelievable fit of lunacy BMW decided that red rear turn signals would look smashing to the American consumer. My blood boils whenever I see those things.
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Swapped my RFTs. Love the results. As I'm now dropping the whole car I'm actually in a funny position as I have the weird offer of two sets of partially used tires for one car.
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Preach it wk! This move back to red rear signals is lunacy! Run flats are annoying too, more unsprung weigh...great. Does anyone realize how much better fuel economy we would get if we didn't have 50 pound wheel/tire assemblies, 19 airbags, 50 more pounds of vehicle numbing material, AWD/4WD everything, bigger every generation philosophy, 300% stiffer frames (I'm all for a solid chassis but the Mk2 VWs, despite their aluminum foil rigidity bodies, handled amazingly thanks to their light weight.
</rant>
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flicmod
- Mar 13, 2007 11:16 am
(#4 Total: 17)
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I second that one bb.
I'm ashamed to admit that my TSX has red rear signals :-(. There's something about amber bulbs that makes me happy. If anyone knows where I can get some amber tail lamp assemblies for a TSX, let me know.
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clace
- Mar 13, 2007 11:40 am
(#5 Total: 17)
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run flats may have a place on performance cars with little space, solstices and corvettes come to mind, but on a more plebian car the expense just doesnt seem to be justified.
btw: Red turn signals cause shame, give me a break!
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flicmod
- Mar 13, 2007 12:18 pm
(#6 Total: 17)
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clace,
Run-flat's don't make sense on performance cars either. As bbechtel said, it adds absurd weight to the vehicles suspension. How is that conducive to performance? A commuter vehicle is a more ideal car to have run-flat's.
Oh, and I prefer ambers to red signals. Just a little sarcasm.
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Well it depends on the type of run flats for weight. I remember reading in the long term blog that the Odyssey has some new kind of run flats that weigh absurdly more than the non run flat tires it can be equipped with. I don't think the weight is significant for most run flats. The weight combined with the degraded dynamics of the artificially stiff tire is with considering though. I think traditional run flats aren't a terrible idea on a sporty vehicle over a jack and spare, but I'm not a huge fan. It's not a fail safe in case you have say a blowout. In my short 5 years of driving though, I've never had to do a roadside tire change. So maybe I'll just toss my spare and jack and keep rolling on my non run flat tires! I think this is a topic we will never reach a common consensus on.
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United States of America, loud'n'proud! |
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I'm crossing my fingers that it never happens, but I haven't had a roadside flat in more than 16 years of driving. I've had a few slow leaks (at least one resulting in the tire being flat when I came out to the car in the morning), but all were capable of being reinflated to get me to the tire store or repair center and were summarily repaired. I tend to pay close attention to the state of wear of the tires as well as whether they at least appear to have adequate air in them (between monthly pressure checks / corrections). So this may have something to do with my (lack of) experience so far with on-highway flats. Another might be just me being extremely lucky.. :P
Oh yeah, almost forgot- I'm middle of the road on red versus amber turn signals. If the taillights assemblies look good on the car I could care less what color is flashing at me when you're turning in front of me. Especially since that means you at least *are* using the turn signals. Too many don't nowadays..
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L.A. CA United States of America |
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Good point Jerry. My favorite turn signal designs are the ones I SEE BEING USED!!
As for flats, I feel like these run-flats have essentially changed the nature of the inconvenience, not removed it. In one case you're on the side of the road changing a flat. In the other you're driving around looking for expensive and hard-to-find tire repairs/replacement service. I guess you're at least still driving in the second case, but not exactly a perfect solution.
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clace
- Mar 15, 2007 5:51 am
(#10 Total: 17)
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thanks bbechtel, and I must agree with jerrywimer, if the car looks good(corvette, mustang, r8) it's turn signals don't really matter all that much.
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gcn
- Mar 15, 2007 10:05 pm
(#11 Total: 17)
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WRT looking for somewhere to replace a run-flat, if this is after hours, and/or you are some distance from a sizable town, you're screwed anyway as you aren't supposed to run them more than 100 miles or so while flat. Even with a temporary spare you can continue a journey of any practical length, at reduced speed.
In any case, run-flats aren't for the user's benefit. They are so that the manufacturer doesn't need to provide a jack, a lug wrench, a spare wheel or somewhere for a spare wheel to live. In other words, so the car can cost them less to make, while claiming it is a user benefit.
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"WRT looking for somewhere to replace a run-flat, if this is after hours, and/or you are some distance from a sizable town, you're screwed anyway as you aren't supposed to run them more than 100 miles or so while flat. Even with a temporary spare you can continue a journey of any practical length, at reduced speed.
In any case, run-flats aren't for the user's benefit. They are so that the manufacturer doesn't need to provide a jack, a lug wrench, a spare wheel or somewhere for a spare wheel to live. In other words, so the car can cost them less to make, while claiming it is a user benefit."
Hmm... I think gcn's post puts it best. I'm with him.
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flicmod
- Mar 23, 2007 1:17 pm
(#13 Total: 17)
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I'm still on the fence with my RFTs, but high pressure temporary spares are generally only good for 100 miles as well at a 55 mph max speed. I suppose the risk is similar if you drove a flat RFT or a T-spare for more than that.
I like the lack of a spare because there's a nifty trunk storage well in its place, but I'm not as happy with the grip or the tire noise after 15k miles of wear.
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"high pressure temporary spares are generally only good for 100 miles as well at a 55 mph max speed."
Yes, but if you live anywhere away from a large population center, that donut spare will get you to a service station where you can get your original tire REPAIRED, something that run-flats do not do. You also have a very good chance of finding a replacement tire of the proper size. Good luck finding the correct run-flat for your particular car in the middle of nowhere; but you will always find a place that can repair a flat.
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hondax3
- Apr 28, 2007 10:42 pm
(#16 Total: 17)
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Today's PAX Tire Ordeal:
Van owned for 13 months, 16,000 miles. New tread depth on PAX is 10/32, mine were 3/32 front and 7/32 rear. Michelin specs are minimum of 4/32 tread depth. Called Michelin at 877-pax-tire (aw, how cute) they now have 24/7 support BTW, that tells you something right there.
Set up a claim number and then called the area dealers for PAX costs, best was $192 for the tire plus $75 each tire for labor (!). FYI another dealer 15 miles away was charging $300/tire plus $100 each for labor and my local honda dealer did not have the PAX machine even though the Michelin database said they did.
Note that I specifically asked about the tire life when I bought the van and the dealer stated it was 35K miles. So today I had the dealer I went to contact the Michelin rep to start the claim, they agreed to pay 70% of the tire cost for the two tires that were out of spec, so it cost me $170+/- to get the two tires replaced after one year, and it looks like I will be doing two more at full price in 6 months unless Michelin comes to their senses. My local tire dealer (non-PAX) said he would put together a tire/rim package for the local Touring owners as he has started seeing quite a few people come in with less than 20k miles and shot tires. He said it reminded him of the Ford Explorer tire fiasco a few years ago.
A few other items: Since I didn't bring proof of tire rotation and my tires were on the high side on pressure (which was done by a honda dealer BTW as the TPMS kept saying the pressure was low) Michelin resisted paying anything until I told the dealer I was going to keep the old tires for the lawsuit that was filed in LA in March, then within literally 10 seconds the Michelin rep agreed to pay 70% as a 'goodwill' gesture. Also I have had two Michelins with material defects on my Pilot. Expect to lose a day if you go thru this tire claim process, it took us 6 hours today.
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ron81
- Jan 3, 2008 11:56 am
(#17 Total: 17)
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It cost me $1300 to replace my four Pax tires on my Honda Odessey.
That included a service charge of two hours for each tire.
Hoping that the class action suit is successful!
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