2009 Acura TL SH-AWD: 3 Series? Acura Don't Need No Stinkin' 3 Series
First things first -- the all-new 2009 Acura TL is no longer an Audi A4/BMW 3 Series/Mercedes-Benz C-Class/Infiniti G37 competitor. The TL has grown by over half a foot in total length, 1.1 inches in width, about half an inch in height, 1.3 inches in wheelbase and between 1 and 2 inches in track (1.1 inches front, 1.7 inches rear). In other words, it's BIG!
Those people whining about what happened to the latest Accord will not be pleased with what Acura did to the TL. And like the Accord, the TL's physical growth makes its presence known as soon as you slide behind the wheel. This is good in areas like headroom, shoulder room and cargo space, where it dwarfs its competitors. It's not so good when it comes to throwing it through corners, even with "Super Handling All-Wheel Drive."
What does this mean for the new TL? Actually, I'm more intrigued by what it means about Acura, a company that has clearly decided to stop chasing BMW and the rest of the German entry luxury sedans. You could spin this move as Acura "giving up" but I'd characterize it more like "facing facts" and "getting smart."
Let's be honest people, nobody is going to consider a front-drive sedan (or even a heavily front-wheel biased all-wheel-drive sedan) a serious 3 Series competitor. They're just not. Acura has been fighting this battle since the first TL hit our shores in 1995 (with some success if you judge solely by sales numbers). But as good as the TL got in its previous form (and it got quite good), it was never going to pull core Bimmer-philes away from their beloved roundel.
Once you acknowledge this reality the idea of bulking up the TL's exterior, increasing the cabin size and injecting it with all (well, almost all) of the latest technology makes sense. If you're thinking you've heard this story before, you're right (can you say CTS?).
So the TL is big and luxurious, but does that mean it lost all pretense of driving passion? No...not all pretense. It has typically precise and informative Honda steering, though it feels a tad heavy. Body roll is well controlled, particularly with the optional 19-inch wheels, but ride quality can be jarring over larger bumps (again, the 19s undoubtedly contributed to the occasional suspension "crash" in my test car).
Power from the 3.7-liter V6 is 305 hp and 273 lb-ft of torque. This proves more than adequate for the TL, despite its two-ton curb weight -- but it's no 335i. EPA rating is 17/25 versus 17/26 for BMW's twin-turbo engine.
And then there's the SH-AWD system. I've liked Honda's philosophy of adjusting power delivery to increase handling response and stability ever since the Prelude Type SH with ATTS. In the TL it works as advertised, giving the car a stable feel through corners despite the new car's size. But like the Chrysler LX cars (including the new Challenger) or a Mercedes-Benz E-Class, I'm left feeling confident in the twisties -- not inspired. Can it be rushed down a canyon road? Yes? Do I want to rush it down said road? Not really. (BTW, I do still want to rush the latest CTS down a twisty road, so there's one defining trait between these two vehicles that have recently abandoned the 3 Series recipe).
No, in the TL it's better to enjoy the plush cabin that's loaded with electronic gadgetry, from full iPod integration to weather forcasting to a 12-gig harddrive ready to rip CDs. I was suprised to learn the TL, even with "Tech Package," does not include HD radio. Also surprised it costs $80 to update the navigation system every year (I got free updates when I owned my Mini Cooper, and the aftermarket unit in my Ford GT can be updated for free via the company's Web site...).
But these are minor issues, easily offset by the TLs supremely comfortable rear seats (some of the best I've sat in) and intuitive user interface that features a bright and clear touchscreen LCD. Rich interior materials and a smart climate control system maximize cabin ambiance, and the car has top crash scores across the board.
There's one other critical area of growth in the new TL: price. A base, front-wheel-drive model with 17-inch wheels starts at $35,000, and if you want the Tech Package on that car the price jumps to $39,400. If you want SH-AWD it starts at $39,000, with the Tech Package bumping it to $43,000 ($44,000 if you want the 19-inch wheels).
I will say nothing more regarding price, except that this new genesis of the Acura TL could face stiff challenges in such a competitive segment...
Also, I get extra credit for not mentioning the grille...until now (note how the silver color somewhat reduces the effect).
- Posted by
- Karl Brauer October 10, 2008, 6:00 AM
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I've never really understood the appeal of this car. If you want a Honda family sedan with a big v6....isn't the Accord your way to go? I guess if you really want that Acura badge on that "lovely" grill....
BTW, great post Karl. Have you had a chance to ride in the new Hyundai Genesis yet or did I miss a post about it?
Nice review. So it's basically a sportier alternative to the ES350. Or a budget A6, maybe? Nothing wrong with that. Acura knows their target market, they sell lots of 'em, and they don't need no stinkin' government bail-out.
Nice car... just wish the front end didn't resemble something straight of the CARS Disney movie.
Add a set of eyes to the windshield and you're all set. Now all that's missing is a cutesy name.
The nose on this car is horrid! Other than that, scott65 is right, if you want a Honda family sedan (which is what the Acura TL is), go for an Accord!
epic fail.
But then again its a honda, so EPIC WIN.
if it was a GM we all know the review would be written in a much harsher tone
Stupid no edit...
Meant to say, if this was a GM, we'd be hearing how it has to be the Best of The Best, and total complete Perfection, to be worthy.
For a honda not competing in the market its "getting smart."
Why are reviews of the AWD 6MT version so positive?
Excellent post, very informative. I'll say straight up that I think this vehicles is ridiculously ugly. I will never warm to the new Honda grilles, and if Acura keeps going with this design trend, I think I'll be bashing them for years to come.
Other then that, it sounds like a good car. Its hard to get excited for something that is so very much not required by my lifestyle. I guess in this sense, the TL is a failure because I definitely love the G8 even though it would be complete overkill for my car requirements.
ahightower has a good point, Karl. Comparison test, anyone?
I say a low-$40s group with the Acura TL, Lexus ES350, Lincoln MKS, Volvo S80 3.2, and Hyundai Genesis V-6 (the availability of a V-8 model moves this one to this class).
I'd also devise a mid-$30s group with the Volkswagen Passat CC VR6, Nissan Maxima SV Premium, Chrysler 300C, Lincoln MKZ, and Toyota Avalon Limited.
It'd be interesting to compare the two groups as a whole, too, to see if there's any advantage to stepping up to that $40k mark.
I would love to know how this compares with Hyundai Genesys.
It's funny you should say all that, Karl, given this:
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FirstDrives/articleId=132226
If Acura has "given up chasing BMW" why did they put together such a comparison drive and
"magically" have their car be seen as the best?
Are you saying that people don't have valid points about the inflation of the Accord? You seem to be by characterizing it as "whining".
And this seems somewhat inconsistent given your review from May of the new TSX. Isn't the TL just a "really really really good Honda" Accord?
Karl, I kind miss the old TL-S. The new ACURA TL front end looks (READY FOR THE NEXT TRANSFORMERS MOVIE I GUESS?)awful.
True, what kills ACURA now is the new HONDA ACCORD Coupe. Acura lacks a sport coupe.
That was a six-speed car, and as described all through that article, it has vastly different suspension and steering tuning to maximize the six-speed's potential. And of course it was a very early production car, so we won't know for sure how itwill drive until it arrive next spring.
Yes, I am saying that people don't have valid points about the Accord's growth. Most of them, as usual, haven't driven it yet. It's not a performance car so having lots of interior space (and comfort, and high-quality -- if somewhat complex -- controls and rich materials) while maintaining excellent steering feel and overall body control is about as good as it gets in a FAMILY car. The TL is not a family car (at least it wasn't) so the larger size and reduced sportiness feel like more a compromise.
Your last line seems to suggest that you think I love this car after not liking the TSX. The truth is I got out of the TL and said, "This is, without a doubt, the very best Honda Accord I've ever driven."
In other words, as mentioned above, it's a damn fine sedan, but so is the Accord for $15,000 less. I personally wouldn't buy a TL over a Genesis, G35 or CTS if I needed a larger permium luxury sedan. If I didn't need the size, I'd go 3 Series or A4 and call it a day.
My above post was a response to Orangutan, BTW.
Karl, it seems like that is the direction most automakers are going. Why try to imitate BMW, when you can go in your own direction? It make sense because if an automaker can create a successful, if not competing formula for near luxury sports sedans then it will help to avoid or minimize comparisons with BMW. BMW will still be the standard for this segment, but it's influence may diminish over the years as Benz, Audi, Infiniti, Acura, Lexus develop their own formulas.
I think other companies realized they overreacted in their attempts to copy BMW's success. It may be part of German automotive culture to build small sports-lux sedans, but it's very much a German thing. In the US and Japan, premium has always meant at least mid-size (such as the 1957 Skyline). I think it's obvious that many 3-series sales have more to do with brand strength than with people wanting a premium compact car... in theory, the Lexus ES's market is a bigger one. Besides, the TSX is supposed to fill in the C-class competitor role, even if it kinda failed this time around (a pity; I really wanted to like it).
As for the styling, my girlfriend says Acura's new design direction looks like it's trying to follow Cadillac. I think the latter pulls off their designs better, but it's the same intent - presence and ostentatiousness. Designed specifically for the American market. If the economic crisis results in a slight cultural change, that may suddenly not be cool anymore...
By now, I've come to realize that anything other than a RWD high performance car (M3 at the head of current class) is always going to top the Edmunds Enthusiast's meter in terms of ultimate driving bliss.
My guess's it's because RWD lets you steer _both ends_ of the car (to, among other things, offer the joy of drifting with billowing smoke?).
Still, It's sad to see Honda subcumb to the same old bigger-is-better school, including the bigger wheel fettish without cooresponding suspension tweaks (seems like the Germans are the only ones that can pull this off - perhaps because their suspensions feature hydraulic bushings?).
Darn lack of edit... :-)
I meant that a RWD high performance car _is_ always going to be at top The E E's meter.
(Though Audi's R8 seems to be an exception to this rule.).
Karl, but you said before that new Honda Accord is pretty much FWD BMW. And two questions - how TL is better than RL? RL did not sell as far as I remember. Second question - does TL compete now with MKS (which is looking much better and evidently has the same level of luxury)? A4 is FWD and according to you it is able to compete with 3-series.
A4 can be had in Quattro - 4 wheel drive. Any real Audi-phile doesn't consider the fwd an Audi.
I love Audi's. I'll take my A4 Quattro over a 3 any day. Plus the Audi has a much nicer interior and I prefer the clean, confident styling of the Audi over the 3-series nice proportions but fussy detailing and graphics.
I hate the direction Acura is taking. The beak grille and monstrous slab of plastic called a front bumper just looks stupid. The body creases are interesting but overdone...
My A4 is FWD and I DO consider it a real Audi. There is a reason all wheel drive vehices do not sell in the sunshine states. I get tired of hearing that Quatro BS line..."not a real Audi".
As for the TL it is just another vehicle I can scratch off my list of potential future cars. Acura is making it easy for me. Big, heavy, expensive, gizmo laden, and Oh-my-God ugly.
Audi doesn't market the Quattro as a bad weather/offroad traction device (although it holds a big advantage in those situations).
They market it as a performance device, one that no other german sport sedan offers. That's a major factor in what makes an Audi worth buying.
Fwd isn't great for a sports sedan... which is why the best ones don't have it.
I have to disagree with Karl as I dont think Acura ever directly chased BMW with the TL, RL or TSX. Sure, Acura and BMW have products in the same segment but that doesnt mean they are direct competitors. The only 2 Acura products that are currently positioned squarely against BMW are the RDX and MDX.
These days I think it all boils down to what youre looking for in a car of this calibre. Some prefer the more luxurious side (Lexus/Mercedes). Some prefer a sporty/luxurious car (Audi/Acura/Cadillac). Some prefer the pure sporty side (BMW/Infiniti). Me, although I love that certain sporty something with a great chassis, playful, repsonsive, refined and tactile I do like my luxury features also. I would put myseldf between the sport/luxury and the pure sport.
For me...Im not sure what Id buy if I were shopping in this segment. Cars Id highly consider:
- Cadillac CTS 3.6 6MT FE3 (a bit too blingy/shiney for my tastes but its an awesome blend of sport and luxury)
- Acura TL SH-awd 6MT (exterior styling aside the alleged performance of the 6MT SH-awd model was suprising)
- BMW 335i 6MT Sport (love the drive and the power but the interior is so stark, drab and small)
- Infiniti G37S 6MT sedan (Never really been a big fan of Nissan/Infinti products as they tend not to be refined enough for my tastes)
- Pontiac G8 GT/GXP 6MT (Only if it were available with higher end features (HIDs/SmartKey/Naviagtion) and more upscale interior materials)
In reality its not about which car is faster around the Ring its about the overall package and which package works best for you the consumer.
"As for the TL it is just another vehicle I can scratch off my list of potential future cars. Acura is making it easy for me. Big, heavy, expensive, gizmo laden, and Oh-my-God ugly."
I have advice for people who are so willing to instantly write off certain products from ANY BRAND without even sampling them. Drive them first as they may suprise you. I find it strange when people consider purchasing a vehicle only go by others opinions of a product and not their own. Myself, I choose vehicles that meet my wants/needs (regardless of brand or publication opinions) and then use the process of elimination to determine which vehicle fits my requirements the best.
I remember when I first drove the new Malibu LTZ. I thought to myself...."GM really hit the nail on the head with his one as its a seriously great and cheaper alternative to the Accord EX-L V6."
dude, it's frickin' ugly. This is in a class where it must hit on all counts- it has to at least look presentable. That's part of the cost of admission to the $35K+ club.
What a let down. The previous generation TL was my favorite Honda product ever- excellent styling inside/out with an inviting cockpit and enough space for a single guy like me. Maybe I'll pick up a used one some day... just hate the idea of premium fuel (on principal). Actually, I had the same feelings concerning the previous Accord as well- very nice car but I see Honda/Acura is now intent on building disgustingly ugly vehicles with terrible looking interiors full of nonsensical "styling" themes and an overload of buttons. What happened to the touch screens? It's amazing how Honda was always known for its simplistic approach to interior design with low cowls and flawless ergonomics yet they don't get chastised for their latest offerings. The Accord, Civic, Pilot, MDX, RDX, TL and RL all have intimidating designs that are not the least bit inviting. The interiors alone would keep me away from those vehicles and make the stark 3 series more appealing by comparison.
My picks of this segment:
AWD premium sedan: A4- flawless styling and capable 2.0T powertrain. Lots of available features and larger interior. If it weren't for the fussy MMI cockpit- it'd get a perfect ten.
2WD premium sedan: CTS- great looks/tech, plenty of space and decent if not class leading performance. Only needs regular gas.
Coupe: G37 looks great and has a nice cockpit. Nav/interface is much better than MMI or iDrive. Cheaper than the 335i. Seven speed auto brings it up to date by improving previous abysmal mileage.
but, it's such an ugly car.