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Talk Back Tuesday: Dodge Challenger First Impressions

The 2008 Dodge Challenger stands poised to upstage the Chicago Auto Show this week, and as an avowed Mopar freak I should be fully enthralled by this car's return. Yup, I should be.

But I'm not. While I see the Challenger's return as an excellent opprotunity to cash in on Chrysler's muscle car heritage (and I love the production grille, fuel-filler door and other styling cues) I also see some major problems with the car's launch plan. As I stated last week in my Dodge Charger R/T post, the LX chassis is pretty hefty for a "sporty coupe" -- even one with a muscle car heritage. But there are additional issues that have me concerned, most of them centered around first impressions this car will make on potential buyers.

For starters, what's with the "limited edition" production for 2008? Actually we all know what's with it -- Dodge couldn't get the Challenger into full production mode for the 2008 model year, but they had originally told people it would arrive in 2008 and they still want to beat the Camaro to market. Answer? A stroke of marketing department genius (and if you don't think so, just ask the marketing department guys who came up with it)  -- "The limited edition 2008 Dodge Challenger SRT-8!"

Okay, so Chrysler found a way to turn lemons into lemonade. I can't fault them for that, but I fear the initial run of Dodge Challengers may leave an unintended and lasting first impression on the general buying public. I saw this before with the 2005 Ford GT. That car was supposed to sell for around $160,000, but the greedy dealers where asking between $220,000 and $300,000 for the first year after it came to market. Believe it or not, even exotic car buyers have a gouge limit, and many potential Ford GT customers walked away from the car as soon as they were quoted a quarter-million-dollar price by their local Ford store.

Eventually (as with all "hot" cars) the Ford GT's price came down. In fact, it came down so much that plenty of dealers originally trying to get $250,000 were calling back every name on their waiting list a year later trying to get that $160,000 MSRP -- and not having much luck. I think many of those potential customers never re-considered the car after hearing that $250,000 price quote, even when prices dropped. First impressions can be mighty powerful.

Now for the Challenger. The initial run will be around 6,000 according to reports, and they will all be SRT-8 versions starting at about $40,000 (before dealer gouging). Also, only three colors will be available -- black, silver and orange. Two of those choices aren't really even colors as far as I'm concerned (black isn't a color, and silver is too common to contemplate).

That leaves orange. This is the official "launch color" for the Challenger (that's the color the automaker uses for all the PR photos and the one it really pushes in the advertising -- the CTS' color was that dark red hue, the Solstice was silver, etc.). I've seen a few "right to buy" auctions on ebay for 2008 Dodge Challengers from dealers looking to start the gouging process as soon as possible. Guess what color every one of those has been? Yup, orange.

So you've got a limited production car that will start at $40,000-plus, most of them will be orange, and all of them will have 13/18 mpg ratings just as summer gas prices threaten to hit $4 a gallon. People assuming the Challenger will be a stylish and relatively economical alternative to a $25,000 Mustang GT (that car's EPA ratings are 15/23) are going to be in for a shock when they start the shopping process. Obviously the car's performance should be stellar with that 425 horsepower V8, but performance as a sales incentive ain't what it used to be...

Will this launch procedure keep buyers away, even when the drivetrain and color options open up and the price drops? Perhaps not. Obviously the die-hard Challenger fans won't balk at the price, limited color choices or low fuel mileage. But how many of those guys are out there? When the sub-$30,000 R/T versions finally hit next year will people still be waiting around to buy one?

Maybe...but three years later I continue to get people saying, "Hey, nice Ford GT. Weren't those things like $250,000? I liked 'em but that price seemed too high."

Once again, first impressions can be mighty powerful.

Dodge's response might be, "We've never seen the Challenger as a high-volume vehicle." In that case, don't change a thing.

Posted by Karl Feb 5, 2008 7:00 am

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Categories: Dodge | Auto Shows | Future Vehicles


Comments

1487 - Feb 5, 2008 8:26 am (#9 Total: 28)  

 
Philadelphia PA United States of America  
"both should have been released a year or 2 ago. Now they are coming out as people think the economy is slowing down, and gas prices are peaking. brilliant."
 
I dont get why people think automakers can change directions overnight just because gas prices shoot up. I find it funny that so many people are repeating this argument against Camaro success but no one has wondered why the new WRX Sti gets 17/23 (with a four banger) in the days of $3.50 a gallon gas. Do you really think the camaro's mileage will be much worse than that? The G8 is slated to get 17/25 with a V6 and the camaro is likely to be 200-300lbs lighter so I would assume 18/26 is realistic for the V6. That is not terrible mileage for a sporty car.
 
The camaro is based on the Zeta platform that just debuted in 2006. The camaro cant just appear out of nowhere because there are no factories to built the car. Once they announced production they had to identify a plant and then retool the plant. These are major tasks involving hundreds of millions of dollars. You cant just speed it up by 2 years because gas prices spiked a little bit.
 
People should wait for the regular V8 challenger and lower prices unless they are huge fans and want the SRT model.

opfreak - Feb 5, 2008 8:37 am (#10 Total: 28)  

 
 
1487 - I'm not saying they could change overnight. or that its even possible.
 
Just that in the grand scheme of things... these cars could be coming on the market at the wrong time.
 
Its the difference between reality and what people think/see.
For example: GM's Quality is about average/above average overall when compared to other car manufactures.
But people think/see GM's Quality as BELOW average.
 
Thats my point, that people will see these cars as being late.
 
as for the sti, yes its milage sucks. But its a very niche product, and not in the spot like this american muscle.

tysalpha - Feb 5, 2008 8:54 am (#11 Total: 28)  

 
Saint Louis MO United States of America  
The Challenger looks great -- but I have to agree with Chavis it's too big (and agree with Karl that it's too heavy). It's really more a competitor to the Monte Carlo than the Mustang or Camaro.
 
Back in the day that would have been fine, when plenty of people were buying the Magnum/Cordoba, Thunderbird/Cougar, and Monte/Grand Prix/Cutlass/Regal -- but what cars are made in this class now? It's not 1978 anymore.

ahightower - Feb 5, 2008 9:09 am (#12 Total: 28)  

 
Texas  
Totally agree that it's a mistake to offer just three colors. They at least need red, white, and blue for goodness sake.
 
Personally I don't get the appeal. As others have noted, this is way too big and heavy to be called a sports car. It's nothing special performance-wise really, since the SRT Charger and 300 have been out for quite some time with the same chassis and motor. Hell, the Magnum has come and gone already in the time we've been hearing about this Challenger. Dodge didn't "bring back" the wagon, what makes them think they're going to "bring back" the big fat-ass coupe?
 
At least the Ford GT was a supercar, and is now a collectible. This will only be a "limited edition" for the time being. One could almost see the logic in paying a dealer markup for the GT, but to buy an early Challenger would be plain stupid. When they finally do get production ramped up, I'd feel like a fool for paying $20K too much, and wish I'd gotten a Corvette instead. Depending on how bad they try to gouge, you might even be able to get a Viper instead! Ridiculous.
 
Dodge and Chevy are both way too late to the party. Ford has had the muscle car market all to itself for what, four years now?

levyrob - Feb 5, 2008 9:50 am (#13 Total: 28)  

 
 
Since I won't be in the market for one of these, I'll be happy to see one of these on the road. Same for the new Camaro. I won't care what the driver paid for it. There were plenty of over-MSRP PT Cruisers on the road when they first came out. Now they are a rental car staple. Same for the Mustang, sadly. Once that hapens, a car kind of loses its cache.
 
I already feel that the Mustang is too large, especially for its passenger space. It needs to be about 10-15% smaller. The Challenger is going to look downright huge. In the meantime, Ford will be able to update the Mustang so as not to let the newcomers entirely steal the show.
 
I'll just sit back and enjoy the eye candy on the road.

moparbad - Feb 5, 2008 10:29 am (#14 Total: 28)  

 
USA  
The Challenger is a nice problem for Chrysler to have.
Challenger exudes presence and substance, something the bread and butter Caliber and Caravan do not.
All hail the marketing power of a Halo car that is obtainable to the middle class buyer.
Chrysler is not making the mistake of building 200,000 of these a year so they should be better than fine with the Challenger.

1487 - Feb 5, 2008 10:45 am (#15 Total: 28)  

 
Philadelphia PA United States of America  
"Thats my point, that people will see these cars as being late. "
 
I dont think performance cars are going to disappear just because gas is $3 a gallon. To people who really want this type of car I dont think the prices will deter them. I do believe that V8s may be less popular than they would've otherwise been but with a V6 the Camaro and the Challenger (once it gets a real modern V6) wont be that inefficient. If people are going to find them to be too thirsty with V6s they might as well say the same about V6 family sedans. The Malibu only gets 17/26 so its not like there will be a huge jump between that and a camaro.

blackadder5639 - Feb 5, 2008 12:26 pm (#16 Total: 28)  

 
 
Karl, I fully agree with your article. Only people who car about the car's muscle-car heritage would be willing to spent $40k+ on it! I know I wouldn't spend that much on a coupe that's not a luxury car.
 
LOL, sabastian. " I find that most people are either only looking for fuel economy or they have no understanding whatsoever of the word "sporty." I mentioned to a friend of mine that I wanted to get a Porsche someday and her response was, "but you don't seem like the type that shows off." She had no idea that people bought cars for how they drove."
 
That lady might have had the point though. I believe most Porsche buyers buy them because they want to make a social statement, liike the styling, and/or like the idea of driving fast cars. I think those of us who buy cars largely because of how they drive are a few.
I'd say most non-enthusiast pay for style, prestige, comfort/luxury, speed, reliability, value and/or fuel economy. Few care about handling, real sportiness or ability to control the car (eg, manual transmission).

chuckg - Feb 5, 2008 1:37 pm (#17 Total: 28)  

 
Bay Village, OH  
"Thats my point, that people will see these cars as being late. "
  
Really? I'm a "people" and I don't think it's late. I could care less if it's late, just in time, or early.
  
I like the way it looks.

george2040 - Feb 5, 2008 1:43 pm (#18 Total: 28)  

 
 
Karl, why doesn't Chrysler simply have a much higher invoice price for the limited edition 2008 Challenger and offer something of value like a bunch of parts from the Mopar performance parts catalog? How about a variety of color options to make the limited number of 2008 models more unique and collectable? Additional dealer markup is totally wasted money that could buy customization instead.

rayainsw - Feb 6, 2008 5:24 am (#19 Total: 28)  

 
Duluth GA United States of America  
4200 ??
 
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FirstDrives/articleId=124470
 
"Think zero to 60 mph in the low 5-second range and a standing quarter in the mid-13s. A better measure of performance, according to chief engineer Helbig, is the 0-100-0-mph test, in which he predicts the Challenger SRT8 will run high 16s. Not bad for a 4,200-pound car."

1487 - Feb 6, 2008 6:36 am (#20 Total: 28)  

 
Philadelphia PA United States of America  
it seems hard to believe the Challenger weighs that much when the 300 SRT weighs about the same.

kurtamaxxxguy - Feb 6, 2008 9:01 am (#21 Total: 28)  

 
portland or  
Weren't there 9000+ orders for this car?
I remember Chrysler or some other site claiming the entire '08 production run is spoken for.
Perhaps this is the trend for performance cars for now on? Mfrs build a very small run, and watch the dealers have their fun...

automaton - Feb 6, 2008 10:20 am (#22 Total: 28)  

 
 
Does Chrysler Corp. know/approve of your photoshopping the Challenger from the desert into the city, and repainting it green??? :) (Referring to your InsideLine home page photo of the green Challenger burn-out).

sabastian - Feb 6, 2008 10:40 am (#23 Total: 28)  

 
 
$40k for the interior from a Caliber? I'll pass.

1487 - Feb 6, 2008 12:14 pm (#24 Total: 28)  

 
Philadelphia PA United States of America  
sabastian,
 
the interior is from the charger which goes up to $40k already. It has nothing to do with the caliber.

sabastian - Feb 6, 2008 4:04 pm (#25 Total: 28)  

 
 
1487,
 
I figured as much, but in terms of quality it's pretty hard to tell them apart. Oh well. It's not as though it will actually stop muscle car lovers from falling all over this thing. The old hot rods weren't exactly Bentleys either.

jdub53084 - Feb 6, 2008 7:26 pm (#26 Total: 28)  

 
 
Chrysler has done the right thing. They took the interest in a car like this, made the car in a way that doesn't re-invent the wheel and takes a good platform and was able to re-use the powertrain and a lot of other expensive parts that didn't need re-designed. I say Bravo!
 
As for wating for 2009 for the R/T, I'm waiting right now.

blackadder5639 - Feb 6, 2008 8:09 pm (#27 Total: 28)  

 
 
Oh my bad! 425 hp for a "mere" $40k+ is well worth the money! Although I believe that they also should have released some of the lesser models now, I think Chrysler might still get away with it if this one impresses and causes a lot of buzz! But I don't know how they can avoid problems like dealers charging exhorbitant prices.....
 
I'm a bit "disappointed" in the 0 to 60 time of "low 5 s range". That is great acceleration, but these days even a car of the Challenger's calibre should do it in around 4 s.

hondacura4 - Feb 14, 2008 7:55 pm (#28 Total: 28)  

 
 
ITS ALL ABOUT PERSONAL PREFERENCE PEOPLE! Yes this car will sell well beacause it does appeal to a certain group of enthusiasts as its supposed to. Is it a sports car? NO, and its not marketed as such. Its a large GT with decent handling for its size and gobs of American V8 torque. Yes, its VERY AMERICAN and there is nothing wrong with that.
 
Is it something Id buy? No, but Im not going to knock it because it doesnt appeal to me. I can see the cars charm as it does have some history behind it and it has more than enough power.
 
If I was going to spend $40K on a sporty coupe Id buy a 335i with the sport package as thats more my idea of a nice all around GT.




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