The above photo is supposed to illustrate a suspension, but I wasn't prepared to remove the wheel. Because the suspension on our long-term 2008 Pontiac G8 GT is a bit confounding to me. I drove it last night in Los Angeles' hateful, seething, evil, boiling cauldron of vile commuter traffic. The G8 was relatively comforting, nice stereo, all that...
But every time I hit a pothole, it felt as if the car had fallen INTO it. And every bump? WHAM! Imperfection? SMACK! Bump? BIFF! If I had dentures, they would have fallen out, and as it was, the glovebox actually popped open. What is up with that?
I assume this is either due to the sport suspension or maybe the combination of summer tires on 19-inch rims. Later in the evening, at higher speeds, the car was as pleasant as could be, and of course, as powerful as I needed it to be. I guess it just hates slow-moving commuter traffic as much as I do.
Doug Lloyd, Senior Copy Editor @ 3,927 miles
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This is what happens with crappy shocks and low profile tires.
400HP and only $30k, they have to cut cost somewhere.
Perhaps aftermarket struts could improve things a lot. Maybe that's a big difference between this car and a BMW - the BMW comes from the factory a tad more finely tuned. Ahhh, but what a great project car this Pontiac would be...
I can't see which Potenzas those are, but I replaced the ones my Miata came with, with Toyo T1-R's, and their sidewalls are noticeably softer. (Which isn't always a good thing, but they're really grippy summer tires too.)
Then I bought coilovers with triple the spring rates, but damping so good that it feels acceptable on potholes (considering). So I wonder if the factory sport suspension is really the way to go on the G8...
They are Bridgestone Potenza RE050A max performance summer tires which are downright amazing in some applications and merely "pretty good" in others. I may be wrong but they (or their run-flat variant) are the OEM tires on the BMW 335i with ZSP and Infiniti G35/G37 with Sport package. They are also the same tires on the Japanese Subaru Impreza WRX STI. That being said, just because the tire model is the same doesn't necessarily mean all RE050As will perform alike in different sizes.
I'd love to give you a ride in my SRT-4 with Stage 3 coilovers. My ex-girlfriend had to ask me to pull off the side of the road while I was in a road with bad asphalt because she was getting to banged up she was getting sick.
Suby, that's correct - 335i's with ZSP (sport package in non-car-nerd speak) come with the RFT version of the RE050A, but BMW is also fitting Michelin Pilot PS2 RFTs on some of the 2008's. My experience with Bridgestone RFTs so far has been horrid. The RE050A's have been worlds better, but I've only had them for 4,000 miles so far. At almost $400/tire though, they damn well better be good!
The glovebox actually popped open? are you serious? What the hell people. I've never had a car with a glovebox pop open due to a bad bump. I hit a pothole in my civic SI hard enough that my wife almost hit her head on the roof and my tire got a bubble in it, but the glovebox was secure.
The symptoms you describe sound like very, very harsh bumpstops. I've also heard of those symptoms when the car has not been properly prepped by the dealership and there is still a block in the springs (leading to a lack of ability to compress).
Those tires do not have a super short sidewall, and this car has the equivalent of the FE2 suspension, right? So this isn't the "ultra sport" level of suspension tuning.
Funky.
Joe
yeah ive done that before...in my 02 honda accord i hit a pothole (that was longer and wider than my car) so hard that not only did the glovebox pop open but the rear view mirror fell so it was pointing down as did both side view mirrors...plus it ripped my mufflers in the back off their mounts (from hitting the edge of the pothole i assume). I was going about 40 on a narrow 4 lane street in the right lane with a dump truck next to me...by the time the suv in front of me fell into the pothole it was too late to do anything..
i don't believe the sport package comes with any retuning of the suspension vs the base g8 gt. my g8 gt with 18 inch all season goodyear rsa tires feels firm but not harsh, even on potholes...
I have to wonder about this post. I took a G8 GT with the sport package, 19" wheels, etc., out for a test drive yesterday. I was seriously impressed. The dealer was great and let me take it on the back roads and put it through it's paces on some nice sweepers and tight turns. On the way back we went through town during rush hour traffic. Slow going. Bad roads. Lots of un-even surfaces, bumps, pot holes and two very rough track crossings. My impression was nothing less than a tight, responsive, properly dampened suspension that really impressed. Me wonders if there is either something wrong with the long-term G8 or you were really driving on some incredibly bad roads. By the way... this car is a looker and is making me seriously consider a domestic for the first time in my life.
those los angeles roads will kill you every time. i had to actively avoid potholes when i drove my mini in that town. i would think the same must be said for any sporty ride. fyi, avoid the corner of pico and edris drive. i was taking my gf to spark woodfire grill (across the street) when i hit that pothole. honest to god, i thought i was going to lose the whole front end of the car. everything was in disarray, much as smrtypants44 described with his accord, minus the muffler damage (thank god).
What tire pressures ??
Compared to my ( standard suspension ) C6 Corvette, I found the G8 GT w/Sport Package ( in 2 test drives ) to ride very well, indeed....
Odd.
- Ray
a harsh ride over potholes is not uncommon. IL just complained about a $60k A6 having a harsh ride with 19" wheels. Several reviews I have seen have said the G8 could use more stiffness in its suspension, not less.
In the never ending desire to be more BMW-like more and more vehicles are coming with firm rides for the sake of body control. MT just tested small SUVs and said the Rogue with 17" wheels had a very harsh ride.
Those rims are sort of plain looking, but I think they're a lot nicer then previous Pontiac offerings, specifically on the Grand Prix.
Rayain - Great point, forgot to ask that myself. What are those tire pressures (and have you checked with an actual gauge?)?
Everything I've read so far indicates this car has a very nice balance between firm and comfy. Maybe that's the case on most bumps, but a severe pothole will bring out the bumpstops?
1487 - I'm genuinely asking this: Have you driven a recent generation BMW 3 or 5-series with the sport package? I don't have much experience with them...I drove a non-sport 2005 330i convertible which wasn't exactly sporty.
But I drove a 2006 330i (the new generation) w/ sport package and 11,000 miles. Even with somewhat worn run-flats, it had a magical ride. It was completely different and new from anything I'd ever driven and made me realize why people rave about the BMW's ride.
Now, I didn't drive it over ginormous potholes. But it went over rough stuff, undulating roads, etc. It somehow perfectly hugged the pavement without ever getting ruffled, feeling harsh, or feeling anything but utterly connected.
Between that and the twin-turbo engine, I joined the BMWCCA.
So I ask people who reference their suspension but don't seem to whole-heartedly respect it: How you driven those models?
Joe
You were driving in relatively slow moving traffic and somehow couldn't avoid hitting a pot hole large enough to cause the glove box door to pop open? Somebody needs to get some remedial drivers ed.
Re the glove box, given the torsional rigidity of today's cars (at least if you believe the manufacturers who seem to be able to improve rigidity by 50% at every redesign) I can't believe that the structure would flex enough to allow the door to pop open. Not a good sign for build quality.
"Have you driven a recent generation BMW 3 or 5-series with the sport package?"
yes. But the roads were smooth.
I never said BMW had poor ride quality. What I said was every automaker is leaning more towards sport in order to garner the type of accolades that BMW gets and rides are getting firmer as handling gets better. Most reviews seem to consider the G8s ride to be just right and if anything people are asking for more roll stiffness.
Maybe the glove box just wasn't shut tight.
I'll bet that if you hit that same pothole at speed, it'd be alright. It's just how the damping of the shocks/ struts is set up. Perhaps simply an oversight or its just something that cannot be addressed without compromising the positive characteristcs. That said, 18's would probably ride better because there is more tire...
Bankerdanny: Thanks for the stab at my driving from the relatively anonymous comfort of your computer. Bravo.
To clarify: It wasn't potholes per se. It was any undulation, bump, anything other than smooth surface, while moving raltively slowly. I was crawling along in traffic. And as I said, all that went away when I was driving faster. I don't know why. Yes, the glovebox really did pop open.
Doug, (a) I recommend that you not post to the blogs if you don't want responses from others in anonymous comfort of their computers(b) get a sense of humor.
Dan Palmer
Evanston, Il (is that public enough for you?)
Time to get on my "infrastructure soapbox" again. L.A. used to have some of the best-maintained roads in the country. But now they're deteriorating because for some insane reason, Americans don't care about infrastructure. (Or we're not willing to pay our fair share to maintain it.)
It's quite simple: The state of the infrastructure directly affects the bottom-line of our national economy. Guess what happens to the latter when the former starts falling apart...
In the meantime, my next vehicle WILL have a softer suspension. (Buick, here I come!)
BD from Ev, Il:
Point well taken. But you'd be amazed at the things people say on blogs that are far from humorous in intent.
I certainly didn't mean my comment in the spirit that you took it.
cheers
Nice - from slug-fest to love-fest. :) Anyway... In my unprofessional opinion, it sounds like the low-speed rebound damping is way too high, while the high-speed is okay. I'm not even sure if this car's stock suspension has two speeds for rebound, but that's what it sounds like. It may actually be that the overall rebound damping is too high.
At low speeds, the suspension is too slow to shove the tire into the hole, making the whole car feel like it's falling into the hole, as you stated. At high speeds, it's possible that you reach the other side of the pothole before you can full "fall into it", so the slow rebound doesn't feel like as much of an issue.
If u had dentures you'd be driving a DTS
While not at all related, the Chevy Impala (both SS and non-SS models) has a suspension bordering on harsh. My '06 2LT with 16" rims and stock Goodyear rubber simply crashed over bumps. I recently dumped the Goodyears and replaced them with General Altimax RT touring tires and the ride improved significantly...no more crashing over bumps. Perhaps a simple tire change would make a difference...
Does anyone know...is the G8 suspension the same that Holden uses in Australia, or is the G8 suspension a US-spec set-up to "tailor the car to North American roads"?
Ha, I was about to comment "driven a BMW with runflats recently!" until I realized someone already got that comment in. My Z4 is killing me, to the point that I have just bought new non runflat all season tires for it. Right now I am driving an 08 328i convertible loaner without sport package, and I am sorry, the noise and uncompliant thump that those tires transmit to the cabin over every corrugation, patch, hole, cats eye, whatever, in the road drives me entirely insane. I dont know how people comfortably live with these tires.