Face-Off: Cash for Clunkers Edition
This week in Face-Off we battle to determine which is the best car to buy for your Clunker trade-in. Now, instead of going the Sadlier route and saying Touareg TDI or Mini, we decided to choose from the Top 10 cars purchased in July using Cash for Clunkers trade-ins to make it more realistic. Frankly, people who own $4,500 cars are less likely to go out and buy $45,000 ones.
Of course, this week's participants - James Riswick and Mark Takahashi - don't own Clunkers, so to make this more realistic, they will dabble in some roll playing. Jimmy Richards lives in Carmel, Indiana, and still owns the 1996 Jeep Grand Cherokee Orvis Edition 5.2 his parents bought him in high school as a used car back in 1999. Marcus Highbridge lives in West Paducah, Kentucky, and owns a 1997 Ford Explorer Eddie Bauer V8 he bought as a new car.
Opening Statements
Jimmy Richards for the 2009 Jeep Patriot
I'm a Jeep guy through and through. When I was a kid, I'd slowly "motor" up my street in the Powerwheels Jeep I got for Christmas and help my dad work on the AMC-era Cherokee he owned in the 80s (it only went through three transmissions). Fast forward a few years and the apple of my eye arrived on my 16th birthday - a Grand Cherokee Orvis Edition. It had the 5.2-liter V8, Moss green exterior with Maize and Roan Red stripes,�Saddle and Moss�Green leather seats and the Up Country Suspension group. It was beautiful, however, was is now the operable word. My old girl now has 250,000 miles on her and she often doesn't start on cold mornings. There's a high-pitch moan coming from the rear suspension somewhere and those awesome two-tone leather seats have worn and ripped to the foam underneath. Years of use through high school, college, commuting and frequent off-roading trips to Crawfordsville have taken their toll.
Edmunds.com says the True Market Trade-in Value of my Orvis is $142 (Holy crap! -Jriz). If I was lucky to get it deemed "Average" rather than "Rough," it would be $331. So, I could trade my Orvis in for an iPod or cash-in with the Cash for Clunkers program that'll give me $4,500 for my Orvis. And what shall I buy? Since my budget is limited, I've got to go with the 2009 Jeep Patriot Rocky Mountain edition in Jeep Green Metallic. Is it a real Jeep? No, it's a Caliber with something called Freedom Drive II that allegedly will go off-roading but I have my doubts. Does it look like a real Jeep? No, it looks like a Caliber with a Jeepish grille, round lights and a boxy shape. Is the interior nicer than my Orvis? Well, it is two-tone, but light beige and dark beige is no Saddle and Moss Green. And I'd swear Chrysler and Jeep have gone down in interior material quality and construction since 1996. Come to think of it, I hate the Patriot and everything it says about the direction of Jeep and SUVs in general (but at least it's not a Compass). However, I like the idea of getting 28 mpg on the highway and there's $3,500 customer cash on the Patriot. With my Cash for Clunkers rebate, my $24,702 new quasi-Jeep will cost $16,702. That seems too good to pass up, but I can only hope I won't keep the Rocky Mountain as long as I did my beloved Orvis.
Marcus Highbridge for the 2010 Ford Escape
Well, it's time to send my trusty Explorer out to pasture. I have to say though, I'm having a hard time letting go of the old girl. There are a lot of memories we've shared - from pulling the bass boat down to the docks to driving Grammy Highbridge to the quilting museum every week. It's served me well over the years, but with over 200k miles on the clock, and a notable aroma of putrified Bass, it's time to move on.� It's also hard for me to get used to the idea of making payments on a car after being free of my car loan for the last eight years.
My Edmunds TMV says my V8 Eddie Explorer is worth $308 if I traded it in. That means the government will give me $4,192 more to get a car from their C4C list. Given my love for bass fishing, I'll need something that can tow a boat, and given Grammy's love of quilting, I'd like something comfortable for her. I've decided on a Ford Escape XLT V6. Four-wheel-drive is a must for those moss-covered moat landings, as are step bars for Grammy's bum hip. I'm also gonna spring for Sync and the Audiophile sound system (I can't wait to say, "play artist Lynnrd Skynnrd") and the cargo area protector (if I had one of those in my old Explorer, it wouldn't smell like dead Bass).
The thing is though, this particular Escape will run $28,465. Edmunds TMV tells me to expect to pay $27,554. Minus the Clunker trade and I'm stuck with 23,054. I'm looking at 484.79 a month. That's pretty steep, but I doubt a deal like this will come again, so going from Explore to Escape.
Rebuttals Post-Purchase
Jimmy Richards
Well, I bought the Patriot, but I sadly didn't get the deal I was hoping for. Since writing my opening argument, it was reported that dealers aren't discounting cars as much during the Clunkers program. The Patriot ended up costing $1,278 more, though I still got the customer cash and Clunkers rebate for a grand total of $17,980. Thus far, my opinions of my Patriot are very mixed. Unfortunately, Jeep Green is only available on the Limited model. What's that about? My choices for the Patriot Sport Rocky Mountain were red, silver and black. I went with the black, but at least I sorta got a two-tone interior with the dark beige/light beige cloth seats.
I was also right about the interior - I've been in my sister's Honda CR-V, the Pat's not even close in terms of quality. I miss my heated power seats and automatic climate control, but I do like the fact that I can plug my iPod into this handy auxiliary audio jack rather than using the old school tape deck adapter. The fact that all the speakers work is another boon, along with everything else that's fresh, clean and operational in this brand new car. Thus far I'm getting substantially better gas mileage in the Patriot (22 combined versus my old 5.2 V8's 14), but this thing is an absolute slug. When I gunned it at a traffic light this morning, it sounded like the time I was on my Uncle Howard's farm and one of his cow's gave birth.
Am I happy with my new Jeep? Not especially. But its huge discount allowed me to get another Jeep for the price of one of those Honda Fit things, while at the same time getting vastly more money for my Orvis trade-in than I would have without Cash for Clunkers. In the end, I guess I'm a winner. Now if I can only find Maize and Roan Red stripes.
Marcus Highbridge
I feel like I just got over the honeymoon of an arranged marriage. The Escape is nice and all, but perhaps I didn't think this through as thoroughly as I should have. Maybe I was blinded by the deal. Maybe I just miss the familiarity of Eddie the Explorer. Except for some of the high-tech gadgetry, the Escape doesn't feel all that new to me. It's got some pretty nifty features, though, and I'm glad I sprung for the Sync. Man, that may be my favorite thing about this car.
The Escape does everything I need it to do, and it can go a lot further on a gallon - Eddie was lucky to get much past 12 mpg before we parted ways. I'm left with a nagging feeling that the Escape won't last the same 12 years as my last Ford. I wonder if other former clunker owners are going through the same thing. Maybe just because something is on sale, doesn't necessarily mean you should buy it. But at least I didn't buy a Patriot.
So who wins? Which would you buy with your clunker?
Marcus must have been driving that Explorer pretty hard if he only got 12mpg out of it. That vehicle is capable of quite a bit more (V8 AWD etc).
I do find it interesting that both went from SUV to SUV. That says something.
Why the crappy domestics made by the UAW?
Should have gone for the CRV, plus the extra 1000. The RAV-4 or Venza would also last for the next 12 years, unlike the Jeep. There is a reason they went under.
(Wow, the site ate my original comment -- it's just like the old days!)
Odd coincidence, I was just researching the Patriot on Edmunds.com yesterday. I don't think I've ever seen a bigger disparity between the official Edmunds review ("Buy a different vehicle instead!") and the posted owner reviews (9.0 average).
All other criticisms aside, it's strange how critics revile the 2.4 I4 engine in Mopar vehicles, but are not nearly so harsh when reviewing the exact same engine in a Mitsubishi.
I believe Nissan's 2.5 I4 and Subaru's 2.5 flat-4 both have about the same output figures as the Patriot's 2.4, and as of MY2010, all are fitted with CVT's. If those other applications are better than the Jeep's, I guess the question is, "Why?"
"Why the crappy domestics made by the UAW?"
When you start a post like that, you don't get taken seriously.
lieutryan - People like you are why we're going to end up selling burgers to one another in this country.
We have got to be the only country in the world where a significant percentage of the population takes pride in crapping on their domestic auto industry. Insanity.
If I were Jimmy or Marcus, and seeing the possible new alternatives, I would seriously seek out a less abused than my Grand Cherokee/Explorer of what I already had in the used car market.
If I was stuck with the choices they made, I'd be much happier with the Escape. Even being 10 years old, I would never stick myself into a Mopar tuppaware container.
As for the customers sticking with SUVs, once you live in a certain lifestyle, it's difficult to stray from it. You begin to think that only one kind of thing can satisfy your needs....like beer brands.
I generally like Jeeps more than Fords, but the Patriot/Compass/Caliber is just that bad, folks.
Ford Escape.
Civic
"When I gunned it at a traffic light this morning, it sounded like the time I was on my Uncle Howard's farm and one of his cow's gave birth."
Too funny.
I'd take the Escape if these two were my only options. That being said if i'm paying $23,054 for an Escape i'd take that money to Carmax and buy a BMW or G8 with a warranty.
I think people get lost in the "free money" aspect. Pick the car you want, subtract $4500 and go buy it slightly used/CPO.